24 October 2000
Source: Court Reporters Office of the Southern District of New York

See related court docket: http://cryptome.org/qaeda102000.htm

This transcript is from an appearance by Ali Mohamed before Judge Sand on October 20, 2000. Mr. Mohamed is one of 17 defendants in the bombing of US Embassies in Kenya and Sudan. And now the only one to plead guilty.


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   1   UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
       SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK
   2
       ------------------------------x
   3
       UNITED STATES OF AMERICA,
   4
                  v.                           S(7) 98 Cr. 1023 (LBS)
   5
       ALI MOHAMED,
   6
                      Defendants.
   7
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   8
                                               New York, N.Y.
   9                                           October 20, 2000

  10

  11
       Before:
  12
                   HON. LEONARD B. SAND,
  13
                                               District Judge
  14

  15

  16                            APPEARANCES

  17   MARY JO WHITE
            United States Attorney for the
  18        Southern District of New York
       BY:  PATRICK J. FITZGERALD,
  19        KENNETH M. KARAS,
            MICHAEL GARCIA,
  20        ANDREW C. McCARTHY,
            PAUL BUTLER,
  21        Assistant United States Attorneys

  22
       For Defendant Ali Mohamed:
  23
       JAMES ROTH
  24   LLOYD EPSTEIN

  25
                (Pages 2 through 9 filed under seal)

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   1            (In open court)

   2            DEPUTY CLERK:  United States of America v. Ali

   3   Mohamed.

   4            Is the government ready?

   5            MR. FITZGERALD:  Yes, your Honor.  Good morning.

   6            THE COURT:  Good morning.

   7            DEPUTY CLERK:  Defendant ready?

   8            MR. ROTH:  Yes, your Honor.  James Roth for the

   9   defendant.  We're ready.

  10            THE COURT:  Mr. Roth, you have an application?

  11            MR. ROTH:  Yes, your Honor.  Your Honor, at this

  12   time, the defendant Ali Mohamed enters a plea of guilty to

  13   Counts One, Three, Five and Six of S(7) 98 CR 1023.

  14            THE COURT:  Isn't it One through Three?

  15            MR. ROTH:  I'm sorry.  One, Two, Three, that's

  16   correct.

  17            THE COURT:  And he is offering to enter a plea to

  18   Counts One, Two, Three, Five and Six of the indictment?

  19            MR. ROTH:  That is correct, your Honor.

  20            THE COURT:  And my understanding is that that offer

  21   is made pursuant to Rule 11(e)(C).

  22            MR. ROTH:  (1)(C), your Honor.

  23            THE COURT:  Yes.  Very well.

  24            Mr. Kenneally, will you arraign Mr. Mohamed.

  25            DEPUTY CLERK:  Mr. Ali Mohamed, please rise for a


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   1   moment.

   2            Is your attorney present, standing beside you?

   3            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes.

   4            DEPUTY CLERK:  Ali Mohamed, have you received a copy

   5   of the indictment S(7) 98 Crim. 1023?

   6            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes.

   7            DEPUTY CLERK:  Do you wish to have Counts One, Two,

   8   Three, Five and Six read out loud to you?

   9            THE DEFENDANT:  No, sir.

  10            DEPUTY CLERK:  Do you understand the charges on each

  11   of Counts One, Two, Three, Five and Six?

  12            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, sir.

  13            DEPUTY CLERK:  How do you offer to plead as to those

  14   counts, guilty or not guilty?

  15            THE DEFENDANT:  Guilty.

  16            THE COURT:  Very well.  Mr. Mohamed, how old are you,

  17   sir?

  18            THE DEFENDANT:  48, your Honor.

  19            THE COURT:  40?

  20            THE DEFENDANT:  8.

  21            THE COURT:  48.

  22            And how much schooling have you had?  How much

  23   schooling, education?

  24            THE DEFENDANT:  I have two bachelor degrees and one

  25   master's degree.


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   1            THE COURT:  And where did you obtain those degrees?

   2            THE DEFENDANT:  In Egypt.  University of Alexandria

   3   in Egypt.

   4            THE COURT:  And you read, write, speak and understand

   5   English without any difficulty?

   6            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, sir.

   7            THE COURT:  Have you received a copy of this

   8   indictment and gone over it with your attorney?

   9            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, sir.

  10            THE COURT:  And has he explained to you the charges

  11   contained in this indictment?

  12            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  13            THE COURT:  And have you told him everything that you

  14   know about these matters?

  15            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  16            THE COURT:  Are there any facts that you deliberately

  17   withheld from your attorneys?

  18            THE DEFENDANT:  No, your Honor.

  19            THE COURT:  I have been furnished a copy of a letter

  20   dated October 19 from the United States Attorney's Office to

  21   your attorney.  Have you signed such a letter?

  22            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  23            THE COURT:  Before signing such a letter did you go

  24   over it carefully with your attorneys?

  25            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.


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   1            THE COURT:  Do you understand the terms and

   2   provisions contained in that letter?

   3            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, sir.

   4            THE COURT:  Are there any understandings or

   5   agreements or promises or inducements for you to enter into a

   6   plea other than those set forth in this letter?

   7            THE DEFENDANT:  No, sir.

   8            THE COURT:  Very well.  We will mark the letter.

   9            Has it now been fully signed by all the parties?

  10            MR. ROTH:  Yes, your Honor.

  11            THE COURT:  All the signatories?

  12            MR. ROTH:  Yes, your Honor.

  13            THE COURT:  All right.  We will deem that marked as

  14   Court Exhibit A of today's date and it will be sealed.

  15            Do you understand, Mr. Mohamed, that you have a right

  16   to continue to plead not guilty, and that if you do so, you

  17   have a right to a trial by a jury of 12 people, at which you

  18   would have the right to the assistance of counsel, and if you

  19   could not afford an attorney, one would be supplied at no cost

  20   to you, as indeed has happened?  Do you understand that?

  21            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  22            THE COURT:  Do you understand that at such a trial

  23   the burden would be on the government to establish your guilt

  24   beyond a reasonable doubt, to the unanimous satisfaction of

  25   all 12 jurors?  Do you understand that?


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   1            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

   2            THE COURT:  Do you understand that upon such a trial

   3   you would have the right to subpoena witnesses and to confront

   4   and to cross-examine all witnesses that were called by the

   5   government against you?  Do you understand that?

   6            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

   7            THE COURT:  Do you understand that at such a trial

   8   you could remain silent, and no inference could be drawn

   9   against you by reason of your silence; or if you wanted to,

  10   you could take the stand and testify in your own defense, do

  11   you understand that?

  12            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  13            THE COURT:  Do you understand that if you wanted to,

  14   and the Court and the government agreed, you could have a

  15   trial before a judge, without a jury, in which event you would

  16   have the same rights and the same burdens would be on the

  17   government?

  18            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  19            THE COURT:  Do you understand that if your offer to

  20   plead guilty is accepted, that you would give up those rights

  21   with respect to these charges against you, and any right to

  22   appeal with respect to any prior proceedings in this case, and

  23   the Court would have the same power to impose sentence as it

  24   would have if a jury brought in a verdict of guilty against

  25   you?  Do you understand that?


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   1            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

   2            THE COURT:  Do you understand that in connection with

   3   your offer to plead guilty, I may ask you questions about the

   4   offense to which you are pleading guilty, and that if you

   5   answered these questions under oath, on the record, and in the

   6   presence of your attorneys, if your answers are false, they

   7   may be used against you later in a prosecution for perjury or

   8   false statements?  Do you understand that?

   9            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  10            THE COURT:  This plea is offered pursuant to the

  11   provisions of Rule 11 of the Federal Rules of Criminal

  12   procedure (e)(1)(C), which provides, in pertinent part:

  13            "The attorney for the government and the attorney for

  14   the defendant may agree that upon the defendant's entering a

  15   plea of guilty:  (C) agree that a specific sentence or

  16   sentencing range is the appropriate disposition of the

  17   case. . . Such a plea agreement is binding on the Court once

  18   it is accepted by the court."

  19            And subparagraph 2 thereof says:

  20            "The court may accept or reject the agreement, or may

  21   defer its decision as to the acceptance or rejection until

  22   there has been an opportunity to consider the presentence

  23   report."

  24            Do you understand that your plea agreement is made

  25   pursuant to that provision, and it further provides if the


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   1   parties agree, pursuant to that provision, that it is an

   2   appropriate disposition of this case that Ali Mohamed shall

   3   not receive a sentence of less than the sum set forth in the

   4   plea agreement?

   5            MR. ROTH:  May we approach for a second, your Honor?

   6            THE COURT:  Excuse me?

   7            MR. EPSTEIN:  May we approach for a second?

   8            THE COURT:  Yes.

   9            (Continued on next page)

  10            (Page 17 filed under seal)

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   1            (In open court)

   2            THE COURT:  Mr. Mohamed, the agreement is that the

   3   sentence shall be not less than a term of years set forth in

   4   the plea agreement.  Do you understand that?

   5            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

   6            THE COURT:  And that if the Court should reject that

   7   agreement, or impose a sentence of less than the terms set

   8   forth in the agreement, then this entire plea agreement is

   9   void, do you understand that?

  10            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  11            MR. FITZGERALD:  Excuse me, your Honor.  Just one

  12   correction, your Honor.  I think the plea agreement will be

  13   voidable by the government, but not void.

  14            THE COURT:  Voidable.

  15            MR. FITZGERALD:  Yes.  Thank you, Judge.

  16            THE COURT:  Your offer is to plead guilty to five

  17   counts charging you with conspiracy to kill nationals of the

  18   United States, conspiracy to murder, kidnap and maim at places

  19   outside of the United States, conspiracy to murder, conspiracy

  20   to destroy buildings and property of the United States, and

  21   conspiracy to destroy national-defense utilities of the United

  22   States.

  23            Do you understand that pursuant to the relevant

  24   statutes, conviction on those five counts would subject you to

  25   a total maximum sentence of incarceration of life imprisonment


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   1   plus any term of years.  Do you understand that you would be

   2   subject to that potential sentence?

   3            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

   4            THE COURT:  Do you understand that in addition to

   5   that, you would be subject to a term of supervised release of

   6   five years on Counts One, Two, Three and Five and three years'

   7   supervised release on Count Six?  Do you understand that?

   8            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

   9            THE COURT:  Do you understand that if you are

  10   sentenced to a term of supervised release, if you violate the

  11   terms and conditions of supervised release, you will be


  12   subject to a further term of incarceration without credit for

  13   time previously spent on supervised release?

  14            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  15            THE COURT:  Do you understand that you also will be

  16   subject to a fine of the greatest of $250,000, twice the gross

  17   pecuniary gain derived from the offense, or twice the gross

  18   pecuniary loss as a result of the offense?

  19            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  20            THE COURT:  Do you understand you are also subject to

  21   a mandatory $500 special assessment?  You understand that?

  22            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  23            THE COURT:  And that the Court may at the time of

  24   sentencing impose an obligation of restitution in an amount to

  25   be determined by the Court, do you understand that?


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   1            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

   2            THE COURT:  Are there any other punishments,

   3   penalties, sanctions to which the defendant will be subject as

   4   to which he should be apprised at this time?

   5            MR. FITZGERALD:  No, Judge.

   6            THE COURT:  Do you understand that you will not be

   7   able to withdraw your plea if it should come about that the

   8   sentence actually imposed by the Court is higher than you

   9   anticipated or higher than was estimated or predicted to you?

  10   Do you understand that?

  11            (Pause)

  12            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  13            THE COURT:  Have you been induced to offer to plead

  14   guilty by reason of any fear, pressure, duress, force,

  15   anything of that nature?

  16            THE DEFENDANT:  No, your honor.

  17            THE COURT:  Are you under the influence of any

  18   substances such as alcohol, drugs or the like that might

  19   affect your ability to understand what you are doing?

  20            THE DEFENDANT:  No, your Honor.

  21            THE COURT:  Then do I understand that you are

  22   offering to plead guilty because you believe that you are

  23   guilty?

  24            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  25            THE COURT:  All right.  Mr. Kenneally, will you place


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   1   Mr. Mohamed under oath, please.

   2            Is there some other form of oath that the defendant

   3   would prefer?

   4            MR. ROTH:  We just asked him whether he wanted to

   5   affirm, your Honor.

   6            THE COURT:  And his answer was?

   7            THE DEFENDANT:  Whatever.  It does not matter.

   8            (Defendant sworn)

   9            THE COURT:  What we're going to do now is I am going

  10   to ask the government to state on the record what the elements

  11   of the six counts are, what it is that the government must

  12   prove beyond a reasonable doubt to the unanimous satisfaction

  13   of 12 jurors to establish your guilt on those six counts, and

  14   then I am going to ask you to tell me in your own words what

  15   it is that you did that leads you to believe that you are

  16   guilty of those counts.

  17            So I would ask that the government now state the

  18   elements of the six causes of action.

  19            MR. FITZGERALD:  Yes, Judge.  It's Counts One, Two,

  20   Three, Five and Six.

  21            THE COURT:  Yes.

  22            MR. FITZGERALD:  So that is actually five counts that

  23   name defendant Mohamed in the indictment.

  24            Count One charges a violation of Title 18, United

  25   States Code, Section 2332(b), which is conspiracy to kill


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   1   nationals of the United States.  The elements of the crime

   2   that the government would be required to prove is that the

   3   defendant engaged in conspiratorial conduct outside the United

   4   States as part of a conspiracy to kill nationals of the United

   5   States, and that, specifically charged in Count One, the four

   6   goals of the conspiracy included murdering United States

   7   nationals anywhere in the world, killing United States

   8   nationals employed by the American military in Somalia and

   9   Saudi Arabia, and, three, killing United States nationals

  10   employed in embassies, and, four, concealment of the

  11   conspiracy.

  12            As to Count Two, which charges a violation of Title

  13   18, United States Code, Section 956(a)(1), and 956(a)(2), a

  14   conspiracy to murder, kidnap and maim in places outside the

  15   United States, the government would be required to prove that

  16   the defendant Mohamed, within the jurisdiction of the United

  17   States, conspired with others who could be located anywhere to

  18   commit an act that would be murder or maiming if carried out

  19   within the special maritime and territorial jurisdiction of

  20   the United States, and that any conspirator committed an act

  21   within the United States in furtherance of that conspiracy,

  22   and as specifically charged, that the indictment alleges four

  23   objects:  killing United States nationals employed by the

  24   American military in Somalia and Saudi Arabia; two, killing

  25   United States nationals at embassies overseas; three, killing


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   1   United States civilians anywhere in the world; and, four,

   2   concealment.

   3            Count Three charges a violation of Title 18, United

   4   States Code, Section 1117, conspiracy to murder, and that

   5   requires that the defendant and one or more other persons

   6   conspired to violate Sections 1114 or 1116 and that an overt

   7   act be carried out.  Specifically, in this indictment it is

   8   charged that the conspiracy sought to violate both 1114 and

   9   1116.

  10            The requirements for Section 1114 is that the goal be

  11   to kill an officer or employee of the United States

  12   Government, including members of the armed services, on

  13   account of their duties, and Section 1116 requires that the

  14   goal be to kill internationally protected persons.  And

  15   internationally protected persons are defined by statute to

  16   include, among others, employed U.S. employees entitled to

  17   special protection by law, which would include ambassadors

  18   located in embassies overseas.

  19            As specifically charged in the indictment, Count

  20   Three alleges that the conspirators sought to kill United

  21   States Government employees on account of their official

  22   duties, including employees of the United States military in

  23   Somalia and Saudi Arabia and employees located at embassies

  24   and, secondly, sought to kill internationally protected

  25   persons and, third, sought to conceal the conspiracy.


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   1            Count Five charges a conspiracy to destroy buildings

   2   or property owned or leased by the United States Government,

   3   in violation of Title 18, United States Code, Section 844(n),

   4   and the conspiracy was to violate Title 18, United States

   5   Code, Section 844(f)(1) and (f)(3).  That would require the

   6   government to prove that the conspiracy sought to damage or

   7   destroy buildings or property owned or leased by the United

   8   States Government, and that a means of that destruction was

   9   through the use of fire and explosives.  And for subsection

  10   (f)(3), another goal that would need to be proven was that the

  11   aim was to cause death.

  12            As specifically charged in the indictment, Count Five

  13   would require the government to show that the goals of the

  14   conspiracy were to bomb United States embassies and kill

  15   United States Government employees; secondly, to attack the

  16   people and to harm the people within United States embassies

  17   and other American facilities; third, to attack the United

  18   States military facilities; and, fourth, to seek to cause

  19   death by such conduct.

  20            And finally, Count Six charges a violation of Title

  21   18, United States Code, Section 2155, which is a conspiracy to

  22   destroy national-defense utilities of the United States.  That

  23   would require the government to prove that the defendant was

  24   part of a conspiracy to interfere with the national-defense

  25   utilities of the United States by injuring or destroying such


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   1   utilities, and such national-defense utilities are defined to

   2   include buildings or structures of the armed forces, and that

   3   is to include buildings and structures in the American

   4   military overseas.

   5            In sum, all five counts will be proven by facts

   6   indicating that there was a conspiracy to kill United States

   7   nationals overseas, which included both United States

   8   employees, United States military employees, civilians and

   9   internationally protected persons; that Ali Mohamed joined

  10   that conspiracy; that an overt act was carried out; that

  11   conspiratorial conduct was carried out within the U.S.; that

  12   conspiratorial conduct was carried out outside the United

  13   States; that bombing was a method of the planned killing; and

  14   that the targets included both military facilities and

  15   personnel as well as buildings, including embassies which

  16   housed internationally protected persons.

  17            THE COURT:  Thank you, Mr. Fitzgerald.

  18            Now, Mr. Mohamed, would you tell us in your own words

  19   what it is that you did and when and where you did it that

  20   leads you to believe that you are guilty of each of those

  21   charges.

  22            THE DEFENDANT:  Your Honor, in the early 1980s I

  23   became involved with the Egyptian Islamic Jihad organization.

  24   In the early 1990s, I was introduced to al Qaeda -- al Qaeda

  25   is the organization headed by Usama bin Laden -- through my


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   1   involvement with the Egyptian Islamic Jihad.

   2            In 1992, I conducted military and basic explosives

   3   training for al Qaeda in Afghanistan.  Among the people I

   4   trained were Harun Fadhl and Abu Jihad.  I also conducted

   5   intelligence training for al Qaeda.  I taught my trainees how

   6   to create cell structures that could be used for operations.

   7            In 1991, I helped transport Usama bin Laden from

   8   Afghanistan to the Sudan.

   9            When I engaged in these activities, and the others

  10   that I am about to describe, I understood that I was working

  11   with al Qaeda, Bin Laden, Abu Hafs, Abu Ubaidah, and that al

  12   Qaeda had a shura council, which included Abu Hajer al Iraqui.

  13            In the early 1990s, I assisted al Qaeda in creating a

  14   presence in Nairobi, Kenya, and worked with several others on

  15   this project.  Abu Ubaidah was in charge of al Qaeda in

  16   Nairobi until he drowned.  Khalid al Fawwaz set up al Qaeda's

  17   office in Nairobi.  A car business was set up to create

  18   income.  Wadih el Hage created a charity organization that

  19   would help provide al Qaeda members with identity documents.

  20   I personally helped el Hage by making labels in his home in

  21   Nairobi.  I personally met Abu Ubaidah and Abu Hafs at Wadih's

  22   house in Nairobi.

  23            We used various code names to conceal our identities.

  24   I used the name "Jeff"; el Hage used the name "Norman"; Ihab

  25   used the name "Nawawi."


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   1            In late 1993, I was asked by bin Laden to conduct

   2   surveillance of American, British, French, and Israeli targets

   3   in Nairobi.  Among the targets I did surveillance for was the

   4   American Embassy in Nairobi, the United States AID Building in

   5   Nairobi, the United States Agricultural Office in Nairobi, the

   6   French Cultural Center, and French Embassy in Nairobi.  These

   7   targets were selected to retaliate against the United States

   8   for its involvement in Somalia.  I took pictures, drew

   9   diagrams, and wrote a report.  Khalid al Fawwaz paid for my

  10   expenses and the photo enlarging equipment.  He was in Nairobi

  11   at this time.

  12            I later went to Khartoum, where my surveillance files

  13   and photographs were reviewed by Usama bin Laden, Abu Hafs,

  14   Abu Ubaidah, and others.  Bin Laden looked at the picture of

  15   the American Embassy and pointed to where a truck could go as

  16   a suicide bomber.

  17            In 1994, Bin Laden sent me to Djibouti to do

  18   surveillance on several facilities, including French military

  19   bases and the American Embassy.

  20            In 1994, after an attempt to assassinate Bin Laden, I

  21   went to the Sudan in 1994 to train Bin Laden's bodyguards,

  22   security detail.  I trained those conducting the security of

  23   the interior of his compound, and coordinated with the

  24   Sudanese intelligence agents who were responsible for the

  25   exterior security.


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   1            In 1994, while I was in Sudan, I did surveillance

   2   training for al Qaeda.  Ihab Ali, also known as Nawawi, was

   3   one of the people I trained.  Nawai was supposed to train

   4   others.

   5            In early 1990s, Zawihiri made two visits to the

   6   United States, and he came to United States to help raise

   7   funds for the Egyptian Islamic Jihad.  I helped him to do

   8   this.

   9            I was aware of certain contacts between al Qaeda and

  10   al Jihad organization, on one side, and Iran and Hezbollah on

  11   the other side.  I arranged security for a meeting in the

  12   Sudan between Mughaniyah, Hezbollah's chief, and Bin Laden.

  13            Hezbollah provided explosives training for al Qaeda

  14   and al Jihad.  Iran supplied Egyptian Jihad with weapons.

  15   Iran also used Hezbolla to supply explosives that were

  16   disguised to look like rocks.

  17            In late 1994, I was in Nairobi.  Abu Hafs met another

  18   man and me in the back of Wadih el Hage's house.  Abu Hafs

  19   told me, along with someone else, to do surveillance for the

  20   American, British, French and Israeli targets in Senegal in

  21   West Africa.

  22            At about this time, late 1994, I received a call from

  23   an FBI agent who wanted to speak to me about the upcoming

  24   trial of United States v. Abdel Rahman.  I flew back to the

  25   United States, spoke to the FBI, but didn't disclose


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   1   everything that I knew.

   2            I reported on my meeting with the FBI to Abu Hafs and

   3   was told not to return to Nairobi.

   4            In 1995, I obtained a copy of the co-conspirator list

   5   for the Abdel Rahman trial.  I sent the list to el Hage in

   6   Kenya, expecting that it would be forwarded to bin Laden in

   7   Khartoum.

   8            In 1996, I learned from el Hage that Abu Ubaidah had

   9   drowned.

  10            In 1998, I received a letter from Ihab Ali in early

  11   January, 1998.  The letter said that el Hage had been

  12   interviewed by the FBI in Kenya, and gave me a contact number

  13   for el Hage.  I called the number and then called someone who

  14   would pass the message to Fawwaz for bin Laden.

  15            After the bombing in 1998, I made plans to go to

  16   Egypt and later to Afghanistan to meet bin Laden.  Before I

  17   could leave, I was subpoenaed to testify before the grand jury

  18   in the Southern District of New York.  I testified, told some

  19   lies, and was then arrested.

  20            MR. ROTH:  That concludes the statement, your Honor.

  21            THE COURT:  The overall objective of all of these

  22   activities you described was, what?

  23            THE DEFENDANT:  Just to -- I was involved in the

  24   Islamic Jihad organization, and the Islamic Jihad organization

  25   has a very close link to al Qaeda, the organization, for bin


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   1   Laden.  And the objective of all this, just to attack any

   2   Western target in the Middle East, to force the government of

   3   the Western countries just to pull out from the Middle East,

   4   not interfere in the --

   5            THE COURT:  And to achieve that objective, did the

   6   conspiracy include killing nationals of the United States?

   7            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, sir.  Based on the marine

   8   explosion in Beirut in 1984 and the American pull-out from

   9   Beirut, they will be the same method, to force the United

  10   States to pull out from Saudi Arabia.

  11            THE COURT:  And it included conspiracy to murder

  12   persons who were involved in government agencies and embassies

  13   overseas?

  14            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  15            THE COURT:  And to destroy buildings and properties

  16   of the United States?

  17            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  18            THE COURT:  And to attack national-defense utilities?

  19            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  20            THE COURT:  Anything further by way of allocution the

  21   government would request?

  22            MR. FITZGERALD:  No, Judge.

  23            THE COURT:  Mr. Roth, Mr. Epstein, do you know of any

  24   valid legal defense that would prevail if the defendant went

  25   to trial?


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   1            MR. EPSTEIN:  No, your Honor.

   2            THE COURT:  And I take it that the pending motions

   3   brought on your behalf are withdrawn.

   4            MR. ROTH:  That's correct, your Honor.

   5            THE COURT:  Mr. Mohamed, are you satisfied with the

   6   representation you have received from your two attorneys?

   7            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

   8            THE COURT:  Mr. Mohamed, have you signed and has your

   9   counsel signed an acknowledgment of rights form?

  10            THE DEFENDANT:  Yes, your Honor.

  11            THE COURT:  The Court finds that there is a knowing,

  12   voluntary plea of guilty which encompasses all of the elements

  13   of the charges to which the defendant has offered to plead

  14   guilty, and the plea is accepted.

  15            The Court will defer until it sees a presentence

  16   report whether it does or does not accept the recommendation

  17   pursuant to Rule 11(e).

  18            I take it that there is no application for bail or

  19   for revision of the terms of bail.

  20            The plea may be entered.  We will set a sentencing

  21   date of nine months from today as a control date.

  22            MR. FITZGERALD:  Your Honor, my understanding is it

  23   is now required to advise the defendant pleading guilty that

  24   he is waiving his right to an appeal.

  25            THE COURT:  Yes.  Is that contained in the agreement?


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   1            MR. EPSTEIN:  It's not in the agreement.

   2            MR. FITZGERALD:  I don't believe it is in the

   3   agreement.  I was advised there is recent case law that says

   4   it should be allocuted to at the time of the plea.

   5            THE COURT:  Do you understand that as a consequence

   6   of your offering to plead guilty, and the Court accepting that

   7   plea, you waive the right to appeal with respect to any

   8   proceedings heretofore had in this matter?

   9            MR. EPSTEIN:  Your Honor, it's our understanding that

  10   he would be waiving any right to appeal relative to the plea

  11   itself, but in terms of subsequent proceedings, there is

  12   nothing in any agreement between the parties that would

  13   preclude an appeal.

  14            MR. FITZGERALD:  That's correct, Judge.  If there

  15   were something done illegally with regard to his sentence in

  16   the future, he is not waiving that, but he is waiving any past

  17   proceedings.

  18            THE COURT:  I believe I did tell him that:  if your

  19   offer to plead guilty is accepted, you would give up all the

  20   rights that you previously had and any right to appeal with

  21   respect to any past proceedings in this case, and the court

  22   would have the same power to impose sentence as it would have

  23   if a jury returned a verdict of guilty.

  24            Anything further?

  25            MR. FITZGERALD:  No, your Honor.


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   1            MR. ROTH:  No, your Honor.

   2            MR. EPSTEIN:  No, your Honor.

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